Curse

Jetdoc · Oct 12, 2006, 07:02 PM // 19:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

The problem with Inscriptions is it effect two things:

One is Inherent Mods, which I think most agree are NOT vanity, and should be available to all.

The other is Rare Skins, which some people think of as the equivalent of FoW armor, and has no game effect whatsoever.

Include Inscriptions, but also include FoW Items for the "hardcore" player to strive for.

Limitations on Inscriptions like customization of Inscribed items, color change, etc., to keep value of vanity items.

In short, I really don't care what concessions Anet makes to keep the "Elite" players happy, as long as in the end, Inscriptions deliver in getting rare mods into the hands of casual players.

A couple of points:

1. Inherent modifiers on Warrior, Ranger and Assassin weapons ARE currently available to all via greens, collector and crafter weapons.

Inherent modifiers on caster items and shields are not.

To satisfy both camps, I think that they should simply expand the green/collector/crafter item selection for caster items and shields to incorporate these uncommon variations.

2. If they do my suggestion on #1 above, then the primary reason for inscriptions IS vanity - applying that modifier (which is already available via green/collector/crafter item) to a skin you like.

The only other possible reason is storage capacity (as Gli mentioned earlier), but I've voiced my opinion about storage management earlier in this thread.

I'm intrigued by the FoW weapon idea, but in the end I think that the same camp screaming for inscriptions will scream about the inequity of those items as well...but that is just a presumption on my part. I think that the customization argument is good in theory, but I doubt that A-Net will force customization on people...

Sid Soggybottom · Oct 12, 2006, 07:08 PM // 19:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by winkgood

A prime example of a liberal extremist point of view. I live in a nation where 10% of the population pays 80% of the taxes. Is this fair? According to you it would seem so since the majority are paying far less proportionately and since the majority are happy then everything is just peachy. To me, this is a very selfish point of view. Now to bring this back to the topic at hand.

What the hell are you going on about here? How does this apply to GW at all? It's not like the upper crust of GW traders are paying taxes or paying anything at all to anyone else. For crying out loud, stop using stupid analogies that dont apply to anything at all.

Geezus, I dont mind differing opinions but bringing up ridiculous arguments just annoys the crap out of me.

Omega X · Oct 12, 2006, 07:12 PM // 19:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

Inscriptions will allow your regular Joe, like myself, to equip my heroes with top quality weapons cheap by allowing peicemeal mixing and matching. What the "rich" fail to realize is that this doesn't cost them a bloody cent... I wouldn't buy from them in the first place. Probably a minimum of players actually buy items to get them to the upper end of things.

Consider this... pre-inscriptions (now), my necro has a collector Blood staff
(20/20, +5e, +30 health).

Post-inscriptions - he would have had it faster.

This will benefit the vast majority of players the most. This is as it should be.

QFT

I welcome this change.

Jetdoc · Oct 12, 2006, 07:16 PM // 19:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

Consider this... pre-inscriptions (now), my necro has a collector Blood staff
(20/20, +5e, +30 health).

Post-inscriptions - he would have had it faster.

He would've gotten it in the starter Shing Jea Island, versus waiting until he got to Kaineng Center in about an hour?

http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Manzo

Wow.

winkgood · Oct 12, 2006, 07:21 PM // 19:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sid Soggybottom

What the hell are you going on about here? How does this apply to GW at all? It's not like the upper crust of GW traders are paying taxes or paying anything at all to anyone else. For crying out loud, stop using stupid analogies that dont apply to anything at all.

Geezus, I dont mind differing opinions but bringing up ridiculous arguments just annoys the crap out of me.

It doesn't apply to Guild Wars specifically but does apply to your comments and your point of view on things. The fact that you are getting angry about it just solidifies what I said.

MSecorsky · Oct 12, 2006, 07:24 PM // 19:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

He would've gotten it in the starter Shing Jea Island, versus waiting until he got to Kaineng Center in about an hour?

http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Manzo

Wow.

Nah, actually the first one I saw was the trader outside Leviathan. He has the 20/20 blood staff... Evil Eye staff I believe. What inscriptions/ selective trading would have allowed is for me to get the +30 health faster.

Which actually points out that that doesn't even include the benefits of inscriptions, good point!

THAT'S where the fun comes in... Koss has a req 8 max damage white Fellblade waiting on the inscriptions option for him to play with. I can't wait... a white 15>50 max fellblade with whatever attachments I choose, when I choose them.

Players will have inventories of their favorite mods/inscriptions that they can mix and match for whatever scenario presents itself.

Hmm... maybe people should stop whining about inscriptions and start pushing for more storage.

Mordakai · Oct 12, 2006, 07:25 PM // 19:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

A couple of points:

1. Inherent modifiers on Warrior, Ranger and Assassin weapons ARE currently available to all via greens, collector and crafter weapons.

Inherent modifiers on caster items and shields are not.

To satisfy both camps, I think that they should simply expand the green/collector/crafter item selection for caster items and shields to incorporate these uncommon variations.

Yes, they could do this.... OR they could just offer Inscriptions and save a lot of trouble of making every combination possible, and continue having to update this ever growing list of weapons with every new Chapter as new professions (and attributes) are introduced.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

I'm intrigued by the FoW weapon idea, but in the end I think that the same camp screaming for inscriptions will scream about the inequity of those items as well...but that is just a presumption on my part.

How many people on this thread do you hear complaining about FoW armor?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

I think that the customization argument is good in theory, but I doubt that A-Net will force customization on people...

And I doubt Anet will create Greens and Collectors that have every combination of mods possible... I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

Mordakai · Oct 12, 2006, 07:30 PM // 19:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by winkgood

It doesn't apply to Guild Wars specifically but does apply to your comments and your point of view on things. The fact that you are getting angry about it just solidifies what I said.

Please. If you want to discuss progressive taxation, start another thread.

This is about Inscriptions. Let's keep on topic.

Eet GnomeSmasher · Oct 12, 2006, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by winkgood

It doesn't apply to Guild Wars specifically but does apply to your comments and your point of view on things. The fact that you are getting angry about it just solidifies what I said.

Say what? So someone getting angry at your illogical and just plain silly arguments is proof that you're right?

....Wha?

MSecorsky · Oct 12, 2006, 07:32 PM // 19:32

Another side effect of the changes - with respect to guaranteed salvage and the weapon not being destroyed...

Party approaches a mob of 'x' and realizes that they're sensitive to cold damage. Party pauses to put cold damage mods on their weapons before attacking.

There are so many ways that this change will benefit the game.

Tank knows that the bonder will be taking good care of him, changes to a +15% while enchanted inscription.

Think of the greater good!

Jetdoc · Oct 12, 2006, 07:40 PM // 19:40

Since I'm intrigued by the continued argument that inherent modifiers are NOT available to the common player, here's a quick list of those inherent modifiers that ARE available, and those that are NOT, via green/collector/crafter.

Available via Green/Collector/Crafter - Swords, Axes, Hammers, Daggers, ALL Classifications of Bows

Damage +15% (while Health is above 50%)
Damage +15% (while enchanted)
Damage +15% Armor -10 (while attacking)
Damage +15% Energy -5
Damage +15% (vs. hexed foes)
Damage +20% (while Health is below 50%)
Damage +20% (while hexed)
Energy +5

Available via Green/Collector/Crafter - Shields

Tactics HP +30 Damage -5 (20%)
Tactics HP +45 enchanted Damage -2 enchanted
Tactics HP +30 damage -2 (enchanted)
Tactics HP +45 stanced Damage -2 stanced
Tactics HP +60 hexed Damage -3 hexed
Tactics HP +30 Tactics +1 (20%)
Tactics HP +30 armor +10 (vs piercing)
Strength HP +30 Damage -5 (20%)
Strength HP +45 enchanted Damage -2 enchanted
Strength HP +30 damage -2 (enchanted)
Strength HP +45 stanced Damage -2 stanced
Strength HP +30 damage -2 (stanced)
Strength HP +60 hexed Damage -3 hexed
Strength HP +30 Strength +1 (20%)
Strength damage -2 stanced Quick recovery Blind
Strength damage -2 enchanted Quick recovery Weakness

NOT Available via Green/Collector/Crafter - Swords, Axes, Hammers, Daggers, ALL Classifications of Bows

Damage +15% Health regeneration -1
Damage +15% Energy regeneration -1

NOT Available via Green/Collector/Crafter - Shields
Tactics HP +30 damage -2 (stanced)
Tactics damage -2 stanced Quick recovery Blind
Tactics damage -2 enchanted Quick recovery Weakness
Strength HP +30 armor +10 (vs piercing)
ALL Shields - Quick recovery Crippled, Poison, Dazed
ALL Shields - +10 armor (vs elemental) or (vs slashing/blunt) or (vs creature)
ALL Shields - dual damage reduction modifiers

I'll update this for wands/staves/foci once I get the chance. Please let me know if you see any errors in the above. I can also post the specific green/collector/crafter for each of these if anyone is interested.

As you can see above, there are very few weapons where a certain inherent modifier is not currently available. Shields have a few more specialized combinations that are not available, but I think that is easily corrected by introducing more green/collector/crafter items that allow those combos.

Mordakai · Oct 12, 2006, 07:41 PM // 19:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

Another side effect of the changes - with respect to guaranteed salvage and the weapon not being destroyed...

Party approaches a mob of 'x' and realizes that they're sensitive to cold damage. Party pauses to put cold damage mods on their weapons before attacking.

There are so many ways that this change will benefit the game.

Tank knows that the bonder will be taking good care of him, changes to a +15% while enchanted inscription.

Think of the greater good!

I like it. Of course, if this doesn't transfer to PvP, you even have more disparity between PvE and PvP.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

As you can see above, there are very few weapons where a certain inherent modifier is not currently available. Shields have a few more specialized combinations that are not available, but I think that is easily corrected by introducing more green/collector/crafter items that allow those combos.

Nice list. But again, I think the idea of Inscriptions spawned directly from Paragons spears and shields, and Dervish scythes. And how many combos will be needed by Chapter 10?

It's a no brainer, really.

MSecorsky · Oct 12, 2006, 07:43 PM // 19:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

As you can see above, there are very few weapons where a certain inherent modifier is not currently available. Shields have a few more specialized combinations that are not available, but I think that is easily corrected by introducing more green/collector/crafter items that allow those combos.

Very nice, and excellent work.

Now, if I may, what would be the problem with me taking a white plain fellblade, dropping a 15>50 and some mods on it and giving it to Koss to play with?

sixdartbart · Oct 12, 2006, 07:44 PM // 19:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

Another side effect of the changes - with respect to guaranteed salvage and the weapon not being destroyed...

Party approaches a mob of 'x' and realizes that they're sensitive to cold damage. Party pauses to put cold damage mods on their weapons before attacking.

There are so many ways that this change will benefit the game.

Tank knows that the bonder will be taking good care of him, changes to a +15% while enchanted inscription.

Think of the greater good!

And by that logic why not be able to change your skill bar while you are in a mission because you might find something that some of your other skills would work better on...

Ever here of being prepared before going out to kill things???

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

Think of the greater good!

OMFG even if it would save one grawl wouldn't it be worth it...

Hey Wink don't worry some people understand painfully well the point you were making and others will never be able to

Eet GnomeSmasher · Oct 12, 2006, 07:44 PM // 19:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

Since I'm intrigued by the continued argument that inherent modifiers are NOT available to the common player, here's a quick list of those inherent modifiers that ARE available, and those that are NOT, via green/collector/crafter.

*big list here*

And as you can see it gets very messy trying to put out collectors/greens with every possible combination out there. Wouldnt a simple inscription/improved salvaging system be far better?

Imagine trying to put out a shield collector for every possible combination. Yikes.

MSecorsky · Oct 12, 2006, 07:47 PM // 19:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixdartbart

And by that logic why not be able to change your skill bar while you are in a mission because you might find something that some of your other skills would work better on...

Ever here of being prepared before going out to kill things???

Your attempt at logic fails simply because people can take multiple weapons with them and switch weapons. Now we may have the chance to switch mods rather than weapons.

Mordakai · Oct 12, 2006, 07:51 PM // 19:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

Your attempt at logic fails simply because people can take multiple weapons with them and switch weapons. Now we may have the chance to switch mods rather than weapons.

We can switch weapons AND armor.

When we gain levels, we can update our stats on the spot.

When getting a new skill, we can update that in the field.

Why not change Mods as well?

Jetdoc · Oct 12, 2006, 07:53 PM // 19:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

THAT'S where the fun comes in... Koss has a req 8 max damage white Fellblade waiting on the inscriptions option for him to play with. I can't wait... a white 15>50 max fellblade with whatever attachments I choose, when I choose them.

I'm exactly with you there...I have a number of weapons with skins I love that I can't wait to update. Perfect Hand Axe/Stone Summit Warlord Shield collection - here I come!

But then again, that's really selfish on my part...it's instant gratification. After I upgrade them, I really don't have much more use of pursuing other items, as I would have obtained my "perfect" item.

That eliminates a goal in the game for me...as it would for many, many others. That's why I think this change is bad for the game, IMO.

MSecorsky · Oct 12, 2006, 07:55 PM // 19:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

We can switch weapons AND armor.

When we gain levels, we can update our stats on the spot.

When getting a new skill, we can update that in the field.

Why not change Mods as well?

Yeah, exactly my point.

MSecorsky · Oct 12, 2006, 08:00 PM // 20:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

I'm exactly with you there...I have a number of weapons with skins I love that I can't wait to update. Perfect Hand Axe/Stone Summit Warlord Shield collection - here I come!

But then again, that's really selfish on my part...it's instant gratification. After I upgrade them, I really don't have much more use of pursuing other items, as I would have obtained my "perfect" item.

That eliminates a goal in the game for me...as it would for many, many others. That's why I think this change is bad for the game, IMO.

Instant gratification? All that planning, that hoarding of weapons to scavange from to get just what you want... the salvaging, discarding worthless mods, keeping perfect... salvaging leftovers for materials... hardly instant. Plus you need to find your skin of choice in the first place.

It makes me wonder... if all you have left in the game is getting that 'perfect' item... why do you still play? I may want perfect items for my characters and heroes all around, but that's not the be-all and end-all of the game. There's still the game to play, the titles to get, the missions to achieve masters in...

If you lose interest in the game because you finally get your perfect weapon, you need to rethink what you do in the evening.